What's an inversion these days?

[shocker]

With the introduction of flying and 4-D coasters, the inversion has taken new meanings. Is an inversion when the rider goes upside down, or when the track does? Superman: Ultimate Flight has an inline twist which is counted as an inversion, but is the rider inverted? The that sort of inversion counts, why doesn't V2 at SFMW count for one too?
in my opinion the riders are more inverted on V2.
Compare...
http://www.rcdb.com/ig1143.htm?picture=8
http://www.rcdb.com/ig1568.htm?picture=36

[EagleFan344]

After riding Hydra I just dont know...

[Ilovthevu']

It probably does count as an inversion. Six Flags probably never gave the word to declare that it is an inversion after they changed the roller coaster. The thing that bothers me is Mind Bender. It's a triple looping coaster, but it only goes upside down twice.

The third one is just on its sides. It reminds more Raging Bull first helix.

[CoasterDude12-2]

Anyone who calls Mindbender a 3 looping coaster should ride it. There's no way that helix turn is an inversion, Flashback at MM has more tight turns and that apparently has no inversions.

[shocker]

What do you guys think about inclined loops? Mind Bender at SFOG has one, but at 45 degrees, and it doesn't count, so is a loop an inversion if it is more vertical than horizontal?

Mantis
Riddler's Revenge
Mind Bender

[CoasterDude12-2]

Thing about Mind Bender, the "loop" starts at the top, not the bottom, like you said. I think an inversion has to be a full 90o but riders don't have to go upside down. I don't know why EEjandka (sp?) gets the record because the cars are inverting, not the track.

[EagleFan344]

http://www.rcdb.com/ig2528.htm?picture=17

inversion? yeah right.

[FParker185]

mathmatically speaking a loop is not an inversion, which is why Mindbender has 3 loops, only 2 of them being traditional Vertical Loops (I believe one of the drops is considered a mathmatical loop, the one that goes down to the water and back up)

[HoffmanMyster]

I would consider anything with the track at greater than 90 degrees an inversion, but thats just me...I dont know what everyone else thinks, but thats my opinion...and yes, the V2 at SFMW should count as one, but I dont know what the rater people are considering an inversion...

[EagleFan344]

^So all overbanks would be an inversion?

[HoffmanMyster]

no, those are maybe...45-65 degrees...I mean to the point where if you didnt have a restraint, you would fall out (if you werent moving), but they dont neccessarily have to be horizontal with the ground and upside down. (in my opinion)

[Galvan]

This is probably the best discussion topic on this site in a while, excellent topic.

[andyvball93]

In my opinion, Mantis is an inversion and so is Riddler and V2, but mind bender isn't

[w00dland]

I think an inversion can be felt differently by anyone, the feeling of being upside down can vary for each person. For example during SUF's pretzel loo I don't feel inverted at all, but the for inline roll I feel totally inverted.

Technically speaking I'm more inverted during the pretzel loop, so it's difficult to tell.

Basically, I think an inversion is when the track twists 180 degress from the way it started in the station.

[Danhockey04]

To me, a real inversion would be where the track makes a 140 degree rotation. What I mean by that is like in NoLimits, banking the track in a 140 degree angle. This is because you are majority inverted, and this should be considered on all coaster types. But really, I thought it is where it at least goes 180 degrees, the track only, flipping cars are not inversions.

[rct2wizard360]

I once remember reading that an inversion was the track being banked beyond degrees.

Frankly, that doesn't make any sense.

[shocker]

To counted as an inversion the element must turn rides a full 180° upside-down.

Looking at Riddler's Revenge, Mantis, and Hydra, RCDB contradicts itself as inclined loops do not fully invert riders. I will chose to believe RCDB catagorizes them as inversions to reduce confusion and upkeep their profile (of respect). Many reference RCDB because it is correct, dependable, and comprehensive, if RCDB starts nickel and diming the 'facts' they will contradict press releases, and possibly records. So in an effort towards simplicity, I believe inclined loops are inversions.

[skaterboarder254]

well i was going to say that when the riders head is closer to the ground than any other part of his/her body then it is an inversion, but obviously with certain coaster types this can't be true (for example the in-line twist on S:UF, which is beyond doubt an inversion). so instead i'll just give up because i can't figure this out.

[Ilovthevu']

What do you guys think about inclined loops? Mind Bender at SFOG has one, but at 45 degrees, and it doesn't count, so is a loop an inversion if it is more vertical than horizontal?

Mantis
Riddler's Revenge
Mind Bender

The angle on Mind Bender is completely different than the other two. It's really a helix on it's side (nothing else).

My definition of an inversion is simple. This is dramatic though. Stop the train anywhere in what you think is an inversion. Open the restraints, and see if people (fake people) were to fall out. That my friends is an inversion.

Superman on the side of the pretzel loop
Batman's loop-top of the loop
Batman zero-g roll-the part you are upside down (duh)
Mindbender-No where!!
Mantis and Riddler-top of those loops

[CoasterCrazy1657]

i consider an inversion as the track going upside down the superman twist is one because the whole track doesn't make you go on your back, just that one part does

[Director_Guy]

Why can't it be both, eh?