The Mess That Is Great America

[Soxman]

My brother decided to pay me a visit this weekend from Kansas and he wanted to go to the park. Against my better judgement I agreed to go with him today. We arrived at the park at 8:50 a.m. and to my astonishment people were actually paying for the special parking. The park isnt even open yet and they are giving their money to the park for nothing. I parked right up against the barrier for the "Special Parking People" and the sad thing about the special parking is that I made it to the front gate before they parked their cars. Whats the point of paying extra to wait in line, park in the special section, and only get three rows closer.We went through security real quick and started our day.We headed over to Superman for our first ride of the day. By the time the ride opened the line was down to the plaza. The worker at the enterance of the ride started telling everyone to group up in even numbers because there was only one train running. I started laughing because she shouldn't be telling us this information, but the information might help the people back in the plaza. One of the last major saturdays before school and Superman is running one train. Later in the day the line house for Superman was full and it still went to the plaza. This problem really messed up that area of the park. The park had to know that lines were going to be huge, so why didn't they expand the shockwave line to make it bigger.After Superman we all headed over to Viper and Raging Bull. Viper was a five minute wait and it was a great ride. In my opinion Viper is one of the most under-rated coasters in the park. If there is one perfect example to show why the park needs a single riders line Raging Bull would be it. While waiting in the station trains left with six empty seats on average. It really didnt matter at that point in time, but aroud 1:00 when its packed thats horrible.The biggest surprise of the day happened next (Not really a surprise). DeJaVu was not going to be open at all today. We went to guest relations later in the day and it will not be open on sunday either. I would just like to congratulate Six Flags and the whole DeJaVu staff for having the ride open for two whole weeks this summer. Great accomplishment this year everyone, next year we will go for a whole month.American Eagle Blue was our next coaster. Eagle was only a ten minute wait and was a great ride. The one problem I had was that around 11:30 we left the ride and noticed that the line was past the snack stand. Why was red not running yet? BAD MANAGEMENT! Speaking of Eagle I would love to see a new coaster wrapped around the ride. It is time we a had a roller coaster interacting with other rollercoasters. Just a reminder to T Biggs that this is my own opinion and not a rumor so chill.One of the most entertaining moments of our day was just hanging around Roaring Rapids. The water blasters is a great way just to hang out and not stand in line. Speaking of lines, Roaring Rapids line was full and extended all the way down to the character meet and greet. My next BAD MANAGEMENT move was that on one of the hottest days of the summer Yankee Clipper (Not Ice Mountain...) wasnt open!. All the water ride lines were maxed and they did not have it open.Rides lines were maxed all day and Great America keeps ripping out flat rides. Power Dive should still be in operation, but it needed to many people to staff it. The problem is that all the carnival games around power dive were open. Way to take care of your customers. I am a season pass holder so I am used to all this garbage, but I feel bad for the one day customers or the people that come to the park for the weekend. I am embarrassed of my home park.

[T_Biggs]

1. Why are attendants not supposed to tell you only 1 train is running? It's not like it's a secret, I mean, come on, it's in plain sight once the rides starts running.2. Sorry you couldn't get on Deja Vu. Just because it's down for one weekend, you shouldn't jump to the conclusion that its down for the rest of the weekend.3. Management isn't bad, considering how bad Six Flags is doing as a company, Great America seems to keep everything running smoothly, more so than I'd expect for a company thats in as bad of shape as Six Flags.4. Is there a reason you address me about American Eagle and a new coaster that you want? If there is, enlighten me.

[Coasterman Jro]

I too visited the park today, and amongst the heavy crowds, the sweltering heat, and a group member who kept complaining about the sorry state of the park, I was ready to go home by 12. For the record, I always stay the whole day (Batman, front row, at night can't be beat.). I Have to say that I agree with most of what Soxman wrote. For a Saturday in August, one train on Superman just isn't acceptable. I notice that they had two running by the time I left, but why the delay? An hour before the park opened, Superman's queue was stretch all the way back to the Plaza. I'm glad I got Superman done and out of the way, and I must say that I really enjoy the front. Up until today, I had never ridden the front, and in retrospect, I regret not riding it sooner. The view was unparalled, and the amazing pop of flytime at the top of the Pretzel Loop was suprising. I thought that you only felt it in the back. Superman is seeming to be slightly less of a waste, but I still have a deep loathing for it.Speaking of deep loathings, Deja Vu remained closed all day, which makes me wonder how much SF cares about it's guests. If Deja Vu couldn't be opened, then it couldn't be opened. BUt notification would be nice (think Dragster).My day was not a complete loss though, as I did get a good ride in on Viper (I got a reride too). I love Viper, and getting one final ride of the season made the trip worth it. Getting to squirt riders on RR was just icing In the end it was good day, and I must say that SFGAm has become far less money-grubbing. On our way home from the park, the large sign facing 94 said "Park is crowded. Please visit another day!!!"

[CoasterDave316]

-Go to SFMM if you want to see BAD MANAGEMENT...I just got back from thier.-Superman was running 1 train for certain reasons im sure and not just because the park felt like it. Same goes for Deja Vu....be happy it opened the 2 weeks sorry you didn't get to ride. And about notification, did you look at the sign out in front of the park...or on the ticket booths? It says its closed right there even on days when it is running so there is plenty of notification. What do you want them to do? Make commercials saying Deja Vu is closed but come visit one of our other 12 coasters?!-American Eagle Red closed at 11:30 is completley normal especially when there is a sign at the split saying "This attraction opens at noon". Once again go to SFMM again and look at Collossus, they run 1 side one day and the other another day. At least red opens. Red is less popular now that Blue is backwards so why open it early when there are less people in that area of the park.-I notice you didn't say GREAT MANAGEMENT! about the sign saying "Park is crowded Please visit another day!" If you ask me that just screams good management. But no matter what park your at, if its jam packed you aren't going to have the best of days.EDIT: ERRR I must have got yours and Coasterman Jro messages mixed up...so this has turned into a response to both of you .

[Soxman]

1. Hey T Biggs if you were waiting down by the plaza and couldnt even see the ride wouldnt you think the right thing for a employee to do is to tell you that only one train is operational and it is going to be a LONG wait. Telling the people in the front of the line that there is only one train doesnt do any good due to the fact that I was off the ride by 10:10. Warning people that they are going to be there a while and that other attractions are less crowded is GOOD MANAGEMENT. I still say there should be an electronic board in the plaza giving up to the minute wait times for each coaster.2. DeJaVu is worthless. Please refresh my memory and state when the ride was built. Then do me a favor a look up or even take a guess (Because you are so smart) and tell me out of the time it has been sitting there how many days has it been operational.3. The park was not smooth today. SSA even had a big line and they were not using the switch backs. The walk ways were packed due to the fact that lines were maxed out and spilling onto the walkways I didnt see one person trying to help the situation by telling people where to stand or even roping off an area4. Theme Park web sites and coaster web sites are built around rumors. They are fun. Everyone gets to say where they want a ride or what they want. You do not handle this situation well at all. If I see a kid say I heard from the Turkish Lemon Chill Guy about the new coaster then yes its BS and lets move on. But people like talking about rumors and you dont let them or you knock them down because you are the Coaster King.

[Soxman]

In response to Coasterdude. Both signs out front about closed attractions were blank. I didnt realize DeJaVu wouldnt be open until I passed the ride. The back parking lot was alomost full by 11:30 on a Staurday. You need to have your coasters open. Why should I be happy it opened for two weeks? That does me no good. I work every weekday and I am not fortunate to shift my time for coasters. The thing is garbage. Low Capacity, Slow loading, ugly, never working. A one minute thrill isnt worth the time or energy. Get rid of it.

[Coasterman Jro]

I just posted so I would like to share my observations with Soxman's post as well as your observations.

1. Why are attendants not supposed to tell you only 1 train is running? It's not like it's a secret, I mean, come on, it's in plain sight once the rides starts running.

I don't think that Soxman's point was that attendants shouldn't notify the guests. THey didn't have to, but it's nice that they did. Soxman was just pointing out how ironic it was that they were telling the people at the front, when it was the people at the back who would have needed to know more. I for one was towards the back, and I would have liked to have been informed of that. You certainly can't tell how many trains they are running from Carousel Plaza.

2. Sorry you couldn't get on Deja Vu. Just because it's down for one weekend, you shouldn't jump to the conclusion that its down for the rest of the weekend.

What information, history, track-record leads us to any other conclusion? This is a ride that opened late, stayed closed for the betterpart of it's first two seasons, and was closed for the first 18 weeks of this season. It only operated fully through 2 weekends before it was closed today (A maxed out Saturday in the summer). Why shouldn't one now come to the conclusion that it will operate irregularly for the rest of the season? What better examples do you have to point towards conclusions you would deem satisfactory? Instead of contributing to outlook of Soxman you only scold Soxman who seems to come to a simple conclusion. This ride has been a miserable experience for the corporation and I am not holding my breath any longer that it will be open when I visit on a crowded, popular day.

3. Management isn't bad, considering how bad Six Flags is doing as a company, Great America seems to keep everything running smoothly, more so than I'd expect for a company thats in as bad of shape as Six Flags.

I agree with you. I recently visited SFWoA, and I must say that that is a horrid park. THe ride ops are unfriendly at best, and the park is less than stellar when it comes to capacity and maintenance. Void of any really good rides to compensate, I could die a happy man if I never visited there again. For the most part, the management is fairly good at SFGAm-at least when compared to other Six Flags parks. Any visit to a Cedar Fair or Paramount Park (Disney is a given) will really put SFGAm to shame.However, Premier inherited an already good park in SFGAm. Just because other parks aren't as good doesn't mean that this park hasn't encountered an obvious decline in its overall quality.

4. Is there a reason you address me about American Eagle and a new coaster that you want? If there is, enlighten me.

I've often visited this site, but I've rarely felt the need to post. Also, matters in my personal life have taken an obvious priority over posting on coaster forums. At the risk of being considered a flamer, or even being banned, I must say that you guys can be real nazi's when it comes to moderating these forums. You willingly lock and delete any topic that gives opinions that differ from your own, or threaten your supreme knowledge of how the park is run. I'm a moderator at a little site called "Coasterforce". We have a thriving international fan base partially due to the fact that we don't over-moderate our members.

[T_Biggs]

Please do not compare us to genocidal maniacs ever again, it is extremely rude, inapropriate, and downright inaccurate.ADMIN NOTE: Don't remove ADMIN NOTES! and once again I say: Watch what you say!

[CoasterDave316]

Soxman: First you complain that Deja Vu is closed and then you say that it should be torn down. If it is torn down that lessen's your chances of getting a ride on it, because not much will fit in that spot. And don't even say "Bring Sky Whirl Back". Every part of SkyWhirl has been melted down except for the cages, so that isn't coming back. Deja Vu worked pretty awesome last year besides the two vallies...and it is a awesome ride. If you say its a worthless one minute ride, why did you spend one minute complaining it was closed?I also have a very hard time believing that the sign outside the park saying which attractions may not be open was blank...unless you looked at it on your way out of the park at the end of the night. By then they have taken the ride names off the sign. Deja Vu is usually even on the sign when it IS operational and working fine. I haven't seen that sign not say Deja Vu since last July, and I visit the park quite often.Coasterman Jro, I have been to Cedar Point many times and it really doesn't put SFGAm to shame. If you went to Cedar Point on a day when the park was at full capacity and Dragster was down, im sure you would have the same complaints.

[Soxman]

Post 1: I am not calling anyone anything, but if you dont agree with someone it always seems like T Biggs is right and everyone else is wrong. Lets stick to coaster talk. T Biggs I am still waiting for your responsePost 2: CoasterdudeIt is not worth ridding anymore. It is no fun to go to Great America and play the guess game. Behind Door number one - Superman one train first year. Behind door number two - No Eagle Red. Behind door number three - No DeJaVu again. Put a ride in thats reliable. Thats all I ask. I understand rides going down, but it has happened way to often this year. When I spend the money to get to the park, food, and anything else I expect rides open when it is packed. When it is not as crowded rides down doesnt really bother me. RB is high capacity and reliable. Batman fast line reliable. You already have Viper and V2 that are not people eaters. It just more crowded and thats not funPost 3: Coasterdude I hope you are not calling me a liar. The sign was blank. I dont want sky whirl back. I am not one of your children on the web site. How about some flat rides. High Capacity rides. I respect your opinions and am grateful or this web site sometimes, but you are not right in this situation.ADMIN NOTE: Enough of these in this post yet? Please read the TOS and do not post 3 posts in a row. Feel free to edit on to your first one as long as nobody has replyed yet. Thank you very much.

[CoasterDave316]

Umm Behind Door #1: Usually is running with 2 trains....Behind #2: Always opens at Noon! (saying that for the second time) and Behind #3: Sucks in reliability (can't argue with you there, but it did pretty good last year) but is a awesome ride, especially in the front row.Im just saying, you really can't complain that its closed. When I went to SFMM, I didn't complain thier Deja Vu was closed (and they don't even have a sign that lists closed attractions) and I didn't complain that Flashback was closed. I knew they were closed for reasons. People don't realize the park doesn't just close them for the hell of it. If it was safe they would open it up. Would you want to ride a ride that isn't safe? I doubt it...especially if its Deja Vu. The ride Safe is sort of unsafe just because its a Vekoma .Yes I am calling you a liar about the Deja Vu sign, I can't imagine Deja Vu not being up thier. I swear, I think Deja Vu is superglued there its been up there so long

[Coasterman Jro]

First of all, I would like to apologize. The term "Nazi" was a bad choice. How about controlling? I assume you already understand the point I was trying to get across.Second of all, I was there before the park opened. When I first got there the sign was blank, and before entering I checked again. The sign remained blank.Also David, I was at Cedar Point on a Friday. The park was packed, but it was still run better than SFGAm. All the rides were open (Dragster was on and off), and they were running all trains on most of the rides. The only coaster where we experienced a flaw in capacity was CCMR. Then again, they cut down the number of trains because they were training new ride ops. All of the staff was friendly, and more importantly, efficient. I experienced a wonderful day at Cedar Point during a crowded day in July. Cedar Point also made it a point to hand out flyers saying that TTD might not be operational (I still got a ride though ). On that day, CP managed to show great efficiency, and an overall consideration towards the guests. The park seemed just as packed as SFGAm today, if Cedar Point can handle huge crowds, why can't SF??As for DejaVu, I can understand complaints towards it being closed, I don't think the frustration comes from really wanting it torn down but from the desire that Six Flags would have choosen a different option in the first place. Why does every Vekoma Shuttle coaster I come across have a bad paint job? Deja Vu's towers looked really bad when I saw them today.

[Soxman]

ADMIN NOTE AGAIN: Just incase you didn't see the above note, do not make 2 posts in the same topic right next to each other. Feel free to edit your last post if it is the last response in the topic. Just so you see it this time im posting it 3 times. We don't hate you or anything we just want you to see it lol. POST 1!!!: SFMM has other BIG rides to choose from if Flashback or their Vu isnt working. Vu and Superman are our two major rides at this point in time. I love Batman, RB, and Viper, Batman and Viper do not get attention like they used to. Their lines are long due to the fact that Superman and Vu do not always run right. SFMM has X, Goliath, and other great rides that make up for some faultsADMIN NOTE AGAIN: Just incase you didn't see the above note, do not make 2 posts in the same topic right next to each other. Feel free to edit your last post if it is the last response in the topic. Just so you see it this time im posting it 3 times. We don't hate you or anything we just want you to see it lol. POST 2!!!: I also love the fact that the ride doesnt open if their are any questions about security. I respect and understand that delima. I do not know if they are just having bad luck this year, but every trip I take there is at least 2 coasters down for half the day. We are not one of the Coaster Kingdoms like Magic MountainADMIN NOTE AGAIN: Just incase you didn't see the above note, do not make 2 posts in the same topic right next to each other. Feel free to edit your last post if it is the last response in the topic. Just so you see it this time im posting it 3 times. We don't hate you or anything we just want you to see it lol.

[CoasterDave316]

Jeffery, How many coasters did you see not running at Full capacity while at SFGAm today? Superman and what else? Do you want them to put a second train on V2?!?! SFGAm is usually always running at Full Capacity so I don't know what your talking about there.Once again, I bring up SFMM...go there where it is really an odd sight when you see 2 trains on one coaster. You obviously haven't experienced the worst yet, if you thought SFGAm was bad. SFWoA isn't half as bad as SFMM as far as operations go in my opinion. Also X and Goliath do not make up for any faults at SFMM...they are by far the slowest moving lines in the park. It took me over 3 hours to get on X and during one of those hours I was outside X's station. I got on the same amount of coasters at SFMM that SFGAm has and thats 12. They have 2 kiddie coasters and 2 of the bigger coasters were down.The reason Cedar Point can handle the same size crowds is simple, they are a bigger park. They have more rollercoasters which helps spreads out the crowds and a variety of flat rides. SFGAm really lacks in the Flat ride department so you have everyone in 11 places basically.

[Soxman]

Where did T Biggs go? I am still waiting for my response from him.When I was at the park I noticedSuperman 1 trainBatman 2 trainsEagle Blue 2 trainsEagle Red ClosedDeJaVu ClosedRB 3 TrainsDemon 2 Trains (Should Be 3)I didnt get to see WhizzerViper Two TrainsYankee Clipper ClosedRoaring Rapids needed more rafts. They were way to spread out.The Park needs more Flat RidesSorry about that Coasterdude - I am going to and from my computer and do not scroll up. Wont happen again

[CoasterDave316]

Umm every ride thier was running at full capacity (except Superman). Just like Mantis at CP can run 3 but only runs 2...Demon is the same. It can only run 3 with supervisors running it I believe, its hard to do I assume.Complaing about Roaring Rapids is getting very picky if you ask me, you can only have so many rafts on the lift at the end.Also T_Biggs probably isn't on the forums right now, which isn't why he is responding. The only reason I keep responding is because everytime I go back to the main page I see somebody new has responded.

[Soxman]

The dock area from what I could see had 3 or 4 rafts. The line was past the Character meet and greet and the boats were spaced far apart - You need to cut of lines if you cant run coasters the way they should be run. Demon is a three train operation just like shockwave. I would rather sit on the brakes behind the station then sit in line.There was also three closed attractions! Where you there today? Did you see the mess that I saw? The majority of the walkways were due to maxed lines. They need to controll the park better.T Biggs needed a time out. He takes this stuff to heart. That was my point from the beginning he needs to chill and only lock the true bs and not stuff he disagrees with

[CoasterDave316]

If your complaining about Demon not having 3, then why don't you complain Whizzer isn't running 5 (5 correct?) and Eagle isn't running 3 (or was it 4?) on each side like they did when they first opened. Every ride thier was running at what now is considered full capacity. Don't complain about capacity, it was there. Its bad when your going as far to complain that there weren't enough boats in Roaring Rapids....you are really digging to find something there. Whats next? Not enough logs in loggers run? Not enough cars on Orbit? Not enough workers in the Dippin Dots place? Not enough fish in the pond by V2? Come on!YIKES: Don't expect another reply from me for awhile, I just realized I have spent more then a hour coming back with these replys . Thats enough for me for awhile, I suggest you take a break too...and continue this another time.

[Soxman]

It was 95 degrees outside. We have had a mild summer and today was one of the hottest days of the year. With all the people at the park it was even worse. Demon has tree trains present. On a crowded day use them. On a dead day only use two. It isnt that hard of a concept. Like I stated I did not see how many trains were on Whizzer. I believe it is a max 5 ride. Use what you have in working order on busy days. Two trains on either side of Eagle has been that way for a while. I really dont remember more trains. I have seen Demon run with three and Whizzer run with three. You have to have all your water rides open and max capacity on a day like today. I am shocked that they took the time to rename Yankee Clipper and it is never open. I wonder how I ce Mountain feels?Sure make a dumb response like that and leave - More cars on orbit huh? - You make jokes to avoid responses

[chimike]

Wow! This is a great thread!I normally just lurk and try to catch up on all of your guys' info but I wanted to throw in a quick opinion.I frequent Knott's Berry Farm and SFMM often. in my opinion SFMM is not the worst theme park around. Like others have voiced about SFGAm, SFMM has taken (probably bigger) a huge hit in its quality over the last 10 years. The GP and staff leave a lot to be desired.As a coster enthusiast, SFMM is still a great park with many offerings that cannot be found at SFGAm. I enjoy it for what it is, just as I enjoy Great America for what it is. Yes, X and DejaVu are issues. Flashback's operations has nothing to do with maintenance or safety. It simply is a 'cost' issue that is related to waterpark operations and other variables. Something similiar to what I had heard in regards to SFGAm's old Powerdive - At least Flashback is still around.My point - Ease up on SFMM. What is one man's garbage is another man's treasure.P.S. SFGAm is one of my favorite parks, its sad to hear that there is a possible decline in quality from the Marriott, or even Warner Bros days, but it is no surprise evidenced by SFMW's and SFMM's condition.

[CoasterDave316]

Ok I guess I get one more in!I make jokes to avoid responses?!! WTF you talking about, did you read my whole post? I made my point at the top and continued to make my point with the joke. You says T_Biggs is the one taking this stuff personally but your the one who sounds like it. This is a place to have fun talking about SFGAm, not to try and make everything so negative because you had one lousy day at the park. Too bad, cry to your mommy about it. It wasn't that bad. You are just being a typical Enthusiass complaining about crap nobody else in the park even cares about. Worry about having fun while at the park, not about park management. SFMM has horriable park management (far worse then SFGAm) like I have said countless times in this post. But I had a great time at the park.I didn't go into the park saying "Against my better judgement, ill go with you to SFMM today". I went into the park saying "Hell yeah, I want to ride X....Deja Vu closed...who cares there are plenty of other attractions I can enjoy" I think I rode 7 rides that day and still had a great time at the park. Chill out when your at the park, or on the forums, relax and enjoy yourself. You will enjoy the park alot more that way, I guarentee you.Don't be a enthusiass, be a funthusias...ok that was dumb, but I needed some sort of joke to avoid a response.EDIT: I just read the above post(after posting this)...see I eased up on SFMM....I just used them to make my point. I had a great time at SFMM during my trip there a week ago, but I could have eaisily been a enthusiass and made the worst of my trip because 2 rides were closed.

[goldmember]

A funthusiast?? Wow Dave.....that was bad

[Soxman]

I love going to theme parks. Disney, CF, Universal, SF. The only park I get uptight over is my home park Six Flags Great America. I get upset due to the fact that I have seen the park in its glory days and it is a shame the way the park looks now. back in 1990's I would average 15-18 trips. Now I am down to 5 -7 due to the fact that I am enjoying other parks. I get upset with people who make up dumb excuses for the park. People on this web site defend the park and never bash it. There is not one park that is perfect, but there are several parks that are better then GA in the USA. Great America is supposed to be one of the Jewels of the SF Industry. If you agree that it is a Jewel you need to experience some better parks because Six Flags is in bad shape. I used to put Great America in the same catagory as CF and Universal - Not anymore. There are still some great parts to GA, but they are all things WB did not the current ownersI made the statement "Against my better judgement" b/c I knew the park was going to be packed - I usually avoid the park in June, July, and August due to crowds, but my brother was in town

[Galvan]

Soxman, If your complaining about GA so much, when why did you go? And if you like complaining so much, why tell people on an internet forum? What are we gonna do about it? Why dont your write a letter to Six Flags or Sue them or something other then Complain and cause fights on the forum.P.S. The CUBS will be Chicago's only Post Season Baseball this year

[Spacely41]

Yeah I agree, only don't try to sue them.